Details of my life outside of Castles Made of Sand including music I'm into, books I'm digging, people I love/hate, and everything in between.
Monday, March 26, 2012
The Murder of Trayvon Martin
In light of the latest bullshit released today pertaining to the murder of Trayvon Martin, I am more furious than I was yesterday about the case. All I can say is...are you fucking kidding me? Listen, the 911 call shoots George Zimmerman's whole 'self-defense' line STRAIGHT OUT OF THE WATER! Not only does he make remarks like the highly witty 'These assholes always get away' after which he DOES whisper 'fucking coons!' (It's right after he talks about Trayvon approaching a back entrance..I didn't even realize people still used that as a racial slur until this all went down, by the way...), he was also told NOT TO FOLLOW Trayvon. You cannot stalk a stranger who is minding their own business walking down the street with a gun ON YOUR PERSON, confront this stranger, shoot him, and then claim self-defense. Where was this fear for his life when he got out of his vehicle after he was told not to and he perused a 17 year old boy who was doing nothing wrong? I think it is sickening that Trayvon's body was drug tested but Zimmerman was not, that Trayvon getting kicked out of school for having an empty weed bag (which unless it happened over thirty days before the shooting, was apparently not his since there were no drugs in his system and pot stays in for 30 days) and things on his facebook have been called in to make people question the integrity of the MURDER victim but yet Zimmerman's three prior violent arrests and who his parents are have not been mentioned that I have heard in the media at all. So here, let me school ya: According to court records: George Zimmerman is the son of retired Virginia Supreme Court magistrate Judge Robert J. Zimmerman, his mother Gladys Zimmerman is a court clerk.... He has three closed arrests 7/18/05 for resisting an officer w/violence, and battery on a law enforcement Officer div 10... 8/9/05 for domestic violence div 44... 8/10/05 for domestic violence div 46...
Clearly we're dealing with a real stand up guy, huh? No, what we have here is another little rich boy whose daddy, and daddy's position, tend to get the prick out of the trouble he creates because he is clearly prone to violence. It is also known that prior to this night, he had made several phone calls to 911 just like this one because apparently he goes out looking to start shit. I would like to know how many of those previous calls ever resulted in the arrest of someone who was actually doing something wrong. But I doubt that information will ever be released. Why? Because the cops are just as guilty as Zimmerman in all this and, like him, they are now attempting to cover their own asses. Don't believe me? Here, listen to a witness...and the validity of the cops not arresting Zimmerman under their little statue:
Now, you want to tell me why this guy is walking free? I mean, this is disgusting. Since when does a person get to kill someone, claim it was self-defense, and simply walk off in the first damned place? The last I checked, you murder someone, you make your claim of self-defense, you GO TO JAIL, you HAVE A TRIAL, and if the jury believes you THEN you walk. Am I somehow mistaken on this? Because 911 told him not to pursue Trayvon, the law that the cops used as their excuse does not apply. Even using it, he was still supposed to be arrested. There is no law, no fine print, that allows this to happen. If there were, everyone who murdered would walk away from it free. This is completely insane. If you have not yet heard the 911 call, here it is. Pay very close attention at about 1 minuet and fifty-three seconds or so into it and you will hear him whisper 'Fucking coons'. It's very soft. I turned my speakers up all the way and even then I barely heard it. But it's there: Oh,and speaking of 911 calls....Here are a few from George's past. See if you might be able to see a similarity in all of them:
So did you figure out what all of these people seem to be doing wrong? Someone should have informed him before it came to this that being a black person in his neighborhood wasn't actually a crime. As far as the screams heard that night, here they are. You tell me who you think they belong to: I've heard grown men scream...on more than one occasion. That sounds like a young boy to me. So despite what the cops want to say to cover their sorry asses, despite what his MURDERER has to say to cover his ass, I think it is clear who was screaming and in fear for his life that night. If you are not outraged by this case, if you are not among those of us calling out for justice, then maybe you should stop and ask yourself how you would feel if that was your son's screams being heard right before he was shot in cold blood and his murderer was let go to walk the streets. Because with George Zimmerman walking free, one day it could be.
This was just released today and I wanted to share it with you all. This is police video of Zimmerman being brought into the station the night of the murder. You can clearly see that there is not one mark on him. The cops lied in their report just as he lied and they need to have consequences for that just like he does. This is ridiculous. Did they think no one would ever find out? http://news.yahoo.com/trayvon-martin-video-shows-no-blood-bruises-george-194108003--abc-news-topstories.html
It's been many day since you wrote this, and some new information has become available since then.
1. CNN, after reporting that it sounded like Zimmerman said, "fucking coons," has had the audio processed to remove as much of the wind noise as possible, and now it sounds like Zimmerman said, "fucking cold." It was unseasonably cold that night.
2. ABC, after stating that the low-resolution video they released doesn't seem to show any injury, enhanced the video, and now you can see what appears to be a very large gash on the back of his head, and spots on his shirt that could be blood. Also, Zimmerman was treated at the scene by paramedics. If Zimmerman really wasn't injured, this would mean that ABC, the police, and the paramedics are all in on a quickly-concocted conspiracy.
You state, "Someone should have informed him before it came to this that being a black person in his neighborhood wasn't actually a crime." But note that Zimmerman doesn't mention race until he's asked about it. At least one of his calls to police in which he reported a black person acting suspiciously, he was going by a description given to him by someone who witnessed people leaving the scene of a crime. Another call Zimmerman made to police about suspicious activity involved 2 whites and 1 hispanic.
Also, you've made an error regarding Zimmerman's violent past. You state "Zimmerman's three prior violent arrests," and you note three items from court records. The first one for "resisting an officer w/violence," stems from a time he shoved an undercover cop who was harassing his buddy for underage drinking, and he didn't realize the guy was a cop. The next to items are not arrests, they are temporary restraining orders, one of which was one Zimmerman took out against his gf/wife at the time. Such restraining orders are given out upon request when there's a divorce/split. No evidence of actual violence is required.
The witness(es) who reported hearing "a little boy" whining must have been hearing someone other than Martin, who was a 6'3" man.
There are 2 or 3 witnesses who saw Zimmerman yelling for help while Martin was on top of him hitting him. Apparently that's when they went to get their phones to make their calls to 911, and did not witness the moment the shot was fired. One police officer wrote in his report that, while Zimmerman was being treated by the medics, Zimmerman said that he had called for help and no one came to help.
Zimmerman had no obligation, legal or moral, to follow the dispatcher's instructions. There really isn't any evidence that Zimmerman didn't stop following Martin. That's part of the issue here: we don't know who was where when the fight got started. Zimmerman has claimed he was walking back to his vehicle when Martin came up to him.
Either way, following someone down the street is not illegal. Nor is carrying a handgun for protection. Nor is following someone down the street while carrying a handgun for protection. I doubt Zimmerman had a good solid to be suspicious of Martin, but being wrongfully suspicious and following an innocent person down a street is not illegal, or immoral. It's just dumb.
"The last I checked, you murder someone, you make your claim of self-defense, you GO TO JAIL, you HAVE A TRIAL, and if the jury believes you THEN you walk. Am I somehow mistaken on this? "
Yes. The way it's supposed to work is: First the police have to find enough evidence to suspect you of a crime, then they arrest you, then you are charged, then you are tried. Step one has not happened in this case. The police have not found enough evidence so far to suspect that it is more likely Zimmerman was not acting in self defense. The law puts the burden of proof on the state, not Zimmerman. "Innocent until proven guilty" and whatnot.
"right before he was shot in cold blood"
Given that Martin had been on top of Zimmerman, hitting him in the face and hitting his head against the ground, and that Martin was shot in that struggle, it's clear Zimmerman was acting in the heat of the moment, not in "cold blood."
Zimmerman may not have had a very good reason for following Martin. Zimmerman may even be a racist (even there's no evidence of this). But, neither of those things mean Zimmerman is guilty of committing a crime against Martin. Martin may very well have been fighting because he feared for his safety, but that does not mean, if he struck first, that he had a good reason to.
If Zimmerman was following Martin too closely, or saying something aggressive to Martin, or making aggressive gestures, then he would most definitely be to blame for the conflict, and would have no claim of self-defense. If Martin overreacted to Zimmerman's presence, or was looking to act tough, then Zimmerman's claim of self-defense is valid. Unfortunately, evidence of what either of them did right up to the point the fight broke out is missing. We may never know who is really at fault here.
First and foremost, I listened to seven 911 calls Zimmerman made in the past. There were two that did not involve a black person. The first was when he called about a group of kids that played in the street in front of a house that wasn't his...he referred to them as a "mixed group", the second was when he called about his neighbor's garage door being open. So if you have links to calls he made mentioning two whites and one Hispanic, please feel free to post. I have yet to hear them. And he absolutely was suspected of domestic violence. In addition to that, he lost his job as a security guard for being too violent and his own associates described the fact that, and I quote, "When he snapped, he really snapped." He was violent. Shoving an undercover cop in a bar because HIS buddy is drinking underage? Yeah, that is inappropriate behavior. Getting fired from your job because you are a loose cannon? Also not ok. And then turning up admitting to murder on top of it? Gee, he might be a violent person. You think?
Martin was NOT a grown man...he was seventeen years old. The average male is still going through puberty at seventeen years old.Therefore, you have no idea how young or old his voice might have sounded.
I do not believe the word of the murderer on who the screams came from. I have also listened to the 911 calls, like the one here in the blog, and what made people call 911 was the sounds of either the screams or the shot depending on which call you are listening to. Witness testimony, including the words of Trayvon's girlfriend who was on the phone with him right up until the moment the fight started, has been ignored showing a very obvious biased toward the few statements in favor of Zimmerman over the many that are in favor of Trayvon.
There is absolutely evidence that he did not stop following Martin. There is the recent testimony of his girlfriend who was on the phone with him (Yeah, they FINALLY decided that getting a statement from her might be important) and she heard him following her boyfriend, there is the fact that you can still hear him walking as he is on the phone with the 911 dispatcher, the fact that he wanted the responding officer to call him when he got there so he could meet him because he had no idea how far he was going to have to follow him...and the fact that they were both away from Zimmerman's vehicle when he shot the boy down in cold blood. Please don't insult my intelligence. I think the police and Zimmerman are trying hard enough to do that with the public in general. He had NO REASON and NO RIGHT to follow him. By doing so he instigated that entire situation. But when you consider the fact that that was clearly his intention from the start (which is why he followed him with a loaded gun)I guess it all played out just as Zimmerman wanted. And it is continuing to play out like he wants. And you are so right...following an INNOCENT person with a loaded hand gun down the street at night isn't illegal...but guess what...SHOOTING THAT PERSON IS!
As soon as he confessed to killing Trayvon he should have been booked and thrown into jail until there was evidence supporting his bullshit self-defense story. Like I said, if the justice system typically worked like this, where a person confesses to murder and is simply let go because he said it was in self-defense, no one would be in prison for murder. A confession is evidence enough to hold him. Innocent until proven guilty is a right held by someone who is actually charged with something. Therefore I can't see where it currently applies to the man walking free after confessing to the murder of a seventeen year old boy whose only crime was walking down the street.
You show me proof that Trayvon was ever on top of Zimmerman beating him...and I don't mean the word of the murderer or the word of the first responding officer who did not do his job. There is plenty of proof that Zimmerman is a fucking hot head who can't control himself and that he killed this boy because this was one time that "those assholes" were not going to run from him. The magically enhanced video done by someone on the staff of ABC shows what MIGHT be a mark on Zimmerman's head. It doesn't prove how it got there. And even if Trayvon had knocked the fuck out of that sorry piece of shit, it would have been him acting in self-defense. He was walking home, doing nothing wrong at all, and he was accosted by some loon with a gun. Trayvon wasn't out there looking for a fight but it is obvious in that 911 call and in Zimmerman's behavior in the past that he was. Bottom line? He belongs behind bars. Period. There is no reason for him to be anywhere else right now. Let a jury set his ass free if they feel that is the right thing to do. But he isn't any better than the rest of us. If the roles had been reversed do you think Trayvon would be walking the streets free right now? I highly doubt it.
By the way, I like how you mentioned how cold it was that night...Sort of explains that suspicious hoodie Trayvon was wearing that tipped Zimmerman off to what a thug nuisance the kid was, huh?
"So if you have links to calls he made mentioning two whites and one Hispanic, please feel free to post."
It was in a call log. The Daily Beast listed them.
"I have yet to hear them. And he absolutely was suspected of domestic violence."
Yes, he and his then-fiance have accused each other of DV. In once instance, he called the police, reporting she came at him with a bat because he went to a concert without her. The cops are inclined to believe the party that calls first. Either way, charges were never pressed.
"In addition to that, he lost his job as a security guard for being too violent and his own associates described the fact that, and I quote, "When he snapped, he really snapped." "
The one supposed ex-coworker who made that claim may be telling the truth. Zimmerman may actually have an anger problem. Doesn't quite prove he flipped out on Martin, though.
"Shoving an undercover cop in a bar because HIS buddy is drinking underage? Yeah, that is inappropriate behavior."
Not at all. There's nothing wrong with coming to your friend's defense. It's not as if his friend was hurting someone, and the cop wasn't in uniform, so Zimmerman's reaction in this case is entirely reasonable. Zimmerman may have a violent personality, but the circumstances of this incident are not proof of it.
"And then turning up admitting to murder on top of it? "
Admitting to killing in self defense is not the same as "admitting to murder." Not only is it legal to kill someone to defend yourself from someone who poses a credible threat of doing you imminent harm, it's also very reasonable.
"Martin was NOT a grown man...he was seventeen years old."
He was biologically a man, 6'3", not a "little boy." I've known countless teenage boys, who sounded like older men, or like teenage boys. I've never met one whose voice sounded like a "little boy." Though, I'm sure there are probably a few out there. Has anyone put out a verified recording of Martin's voice? And, there's one witness, who gave a statement to police, that he saw Zimmerman in the act of yelling for help. The other witnesses who heard the yelling did not see who was doing the yelling. And, there's it's also being assumed that the person who yelled for help is the victim, and not the attacker trying to cover up their own aggression. It could be that Zimmerman started the fight, but was the one yelling for help when Martin got on top of him.
"Witness testimony, including the words of Trayvon's girlfriend who was on the phone with him right up until the moment the fight started,"
She thinks it was right up to the moment the fight started. She thinks she heard pushing in that unrecorded phone call. She could be telling the truth as far as she knows it, and it still wouldn't quite exonerate Martin. She didn't see who pushed whom, or even which person approached the other.
"there is the fact that you can still hear him walking as he is on the phone with the 911 dispatcher"
Can you tell by the sound what direction he was walking in? The speed? The location of Martin at the time? For how long he followed him?
"He had NO REASON and NO RIGHT to follow him."
He actually does have the right to follow anyone he wants, unless he were on private property against the wishes of the owner. If you're in public, people have the right to follow you. What's important is if Zimmerman threatened Martin. If he was dogging Martin from, say 5 feet away, then it would be reasonable for Martin to perceive a threat and defend himself. But if Zimmerman were 50 feet away, then that's a different story.
"which is why he followed him with a loaded gun"
If he's like most people with a concealed carry permit, he carries a loaded gun pretty much everywhere... the grocery store, the gas station, while walking the dog, to a friend's house, to a restaurant, etc. The fact that he had a gun with him at that time doesn't suggest anything sinister. If he were not in the habit of carrying a gun everywhere, and only did so on this night, then that might indicate he was up to something.
"he should have been booked and thrown into jail until there was evidence supporting his bullshit self-defense story. "
In some backwards countries, that's more apt to happen. Here, usually a person won't get arrested until there's "probable cause" to suspect a person of a crime. Arresting someone and putting the burden on them to prove their innocence is not (yet) the norm here.
"where a person confesses to murder and is simply let go because he said it was in self-defense, no one would be in prison for murder. A confession is evidence"
Zimmerman's claim of self defense wasn't the only reason he wasn't arrested and charged. There was also the lack of evidence at the time to indicate he probably committed a crime.
"Innocent until proven guilty is a right held by someone who is actually charged with something."
It also means not arresting someone without probable cause... that is, not arresting someone in the first place and then trying to find a reason for the arrest afterward.
"You show me proof that Trayvon was ever on top of Zimmerman beating him"
Aside from the police, paramedics, witnesses, and police station video, you mean?
"He was walking home, doing nothing wrong at all, "
This is true.
"and he was accosted by some loon with a gun. "
This is yet to be proven.
"Let a jury set his ass free if they feel that is the right thing to do."
After the DA or grand jurty find there's enough evidence to charge him.
"But he isn't any better than the rest of us. If the roles had been reversed do you think Trayvon would be walking the streets free right now? "
No. Martin would have been busted for having a gun underage. If Zimmerman started the fight, maybe Martin would still be alive if it was legal for him to be armed.
"Sort of explains that suspicious hoodie Trayvon was wearing"
Zimmerman doesn't mention the hoodie until the dispatcher asks what the person is wearing. Zimmerman said Martin looked suspicious because he looked like he was "up to no good" (whatever that means) and because he was walking around in the rain. But, because few people seem to be paying close attention to details of the case, they think Zimmerman was suspicious because of the hoodie, because that's what they've heard other people repeat. Naturally, people have a strong emotional reaction to the idea that some guy guns down a young man for no good reason and gets away with it. But the same thing happened in the Duke rape case. Zimmerman might be guilty. But setting aside the emotional reaction and looking just at the available facts... there isn't enough evidence, unfortunately. And just as unfortunately, people are grasping at what facts they can - like Martin's schools suspension - even though it's not relevant.
lmao I have NO doubt that Zimmerman was the one who called the police. lol Perhaps his fiance was wearing a hoodie when he came home and he felt threatened by it. One thing is for sure, he certainly knows the number to 911. I have never heard of the website you are talking about where that call log is located. Again, feel free to post the link to it. The fact that you act as if it is ok to attack someone because they are not wearing a police uniform scares me. What country do you live in? Seriously. I have never heard of an assault case where the charges were dropped because the defendant looked at the judge and said, "Yes, Your Honor, I beat the hell out of him. But he wasn't wearing any kind of uniform". The more I read your arguments on this, the more I understand why you are defending this guy. I am beginning to believe you might think like him. And again...that is scary.
I am not even bothering with your piece by piece argument on how there is not enough evidence. HE ADMITTED TO BEING A MURDERER! Do you know ANYTHING about America's legal system? I have a family member who killed her husband in actual self-defense. She admitted she murdered him, she explained why, she went to jail, she had a trial, and she was cleared because there was sufficient evidence to back up the fact that she was actually acting in self-defense. There is no doubt that he committed the crime. Do you comprehend that? He admitted to committing the crime. The doubt is his motive and that is what a jury is supposed to determine...whether he was justified or whether he is a cold blooded killer. This is not a situation where the cops suspect him...he did it. He confessed. There is no doubt. I can only hope and pray that whoever you are, you are not in any way involved with your local justice system.
The Daily Beast. http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/03/22/george-zimmerman-s-history-of-911-calls-a-complete-log.html Call #10.
Zimmerman never admitted to any crime, let alone murder. I think you're confusing murder and homicide. Murder is a category of homicide, but not all homicide is murder. Homicide is legal some cases, such as self-defense. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder#Legal_analysis_of_murder In order to arrest Zimmerman, the police need to show probable cause that the homicide was murder or manslaughter, and not legally justified. The police say they don't have that, and based on the information available in the media, that seems to be the case. So far, there is: No evidence that it was Zimmerman who got up close to Martin. If Martin cut between houses, then it would seem he doubled-back away from home and toward Zimmerman. No evidence Zimmerman was chasing, pursuing, running toward, or doing more than trying to keep Martin in sight. No evidence that Zimmerman said anything threatening to Martin. No evidence that Zimmerman made any threatening gestures at Martin. Nothing in Zimmerman's statements to the police contradict the evidence. If the police get evidence of one of these, then they would have probable cause to arrest Zimmerman for at least 2nd degree manslaughter, under Florida Statute 782.11: Unnecessary killing to prevent an unlawful act... meaning they suspect Martin of starting the confrontation, but that Zimmerman went too far in using deadly force. But given that Martin was seen on top of Zimmerman and injured him, then it's harder to claim that Zimmerman went too far using deadly force.
"The fact that you act as if it is ok to attack someone because they are not wearing a police uniform scares me."
I'm not a pacifist. I think it's reasonable and acceptable to use violence to defend yourself and others, even against people in uniform. The police routinely beat and sometimes kill peaceful people. I know some people think the police should be allowed to hurt innocent people, or that they should always be given the benefit of the doubt, but I don't. I think they should be treated like everyone else.
""Yes, Your Honor, I beat the hell out of him. But he wasn't wearing any kind of uniform"."
Zimmerman shoved the plainclothes cop in order to defend his friend. He didn't beat the hell out of him. I think Zimmerman would have been justified in shoving the cop even if he were in uniform. Remember that Zimmerman's friend wasn't a threat to anyone, but the cop chose to threaten that friend anyway. And you seem to be holding a double standard here. You're supportive of the police for arresting Zimmerman under questionable circumstances, but you're suspicious of them when they're not arresting Zimmerman under questionable circumstances later.
"I am beginning to believe you might think like him."
1. I don't know the guy any better than you do. 2. Zimmerman was studying criminal justice to become a cop. I don't like cops. I don't like people who plan on becoming cops. 3. I've admitted the possibility he could be guilty. I'm only taking issue with the sensationalist manner in which the story is being reported, and the unsupported assumptions so many people are making. There are few things that upset me more than an innocent person going to jail because of emotional, hasty judgement. Putting an innocent person in jail only creates another victim.
Ok, for the final time...He admitted to pulling the trigger and shooting him which resulted in his death. That is a crime. Self-defense is a motive, a reason, a PLEA that one makes to explain why they feel that they are not guilty despite committing the crime. This is similar to when a person pleads not guilty by reason of insanity. It is a jury that then decides if this reason seems honest and if they feel it does, the person is let go. If you are so sure of your theory that, by the way, makes no sense....the next time someone is fighting you using no weapon after you started the fight by instigating a situation you knew could lead to just that and knowing you have a loaded gun on you, shoot that person. Tell me if the police book you and let you go because you looked at them and told them it was self-defense. Unless of course you are actually Zimmerman. At this point I have to wonder...strikingly similar views and all that. And it is just my luck that I would end up with a cold blooded murderer arguing his defense under what appears to be a very vague profile on blogger. Trust me, stranger things have actually happened to me....
Nothing upsets me more than someone getting away with everything including murder because of who his daddy is, because of the pull his daddy has. I am fed up with rich spoiled pricks who never have to answer for what they do, who are never held accountable especially when they commit a wrong against someone who is not in the same position in life. If old George had pulled this shit on some guy at his daddy's country club I'll bet he would be in jail. A seventeen year old BOY is dead. He will never graduate, he will never get married, he will never go to college, he will never have children. Anything he might have been was ended because George Zimmerman decided he was bored that night and he followed an innocent unarmed kid with a loaded gun and then he pulled the trigger. Trayvon did not start this. Trayvon did not follow George the distance from Zimmerman's vehicle to the murder scene with a loaded gun and without a reason. That was all Zimmerman. And because of his cold blooded actions, two parents buried their son without ever really being afforded the chance to see him live. What if that was your son? Would it be an issue to you then? That is the bottom line. So from here on out, defend your position all you want. I'm not responding anymore. Have a beautiful day.
"He admitted to pulling the trigger and shooting him which resulted in his death. That is a crime."
Not true. It's only a crime under certain conditions. If there's no indication those conditions were likely present, there's no cause for arrest. http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0700-0799/0782/0782ContentsIndex.html
"Trayvon did not start this. "
If Zimmerman said something threatening, or was making threatening gestures (such as following too closely), then you are absolutely correct. There's no evidence of it, though. Given the timing of the phone calls, the distance from the street to the house, and the fact that he was walking fast before starting to run, Martin should have been within spitting distance of home before Zimmerman even got out of the car. That he didn't leaves open the possbility he went after Zimmerman. From that distance, it's hard to make the case that Zimmerman was following too closely. Zimmerman wasn't too close when Martin started running; he was still in the car. Martin may have ducked around a corner and then popped out at Zimmerman, maybe intentionally, maybe unintentionally. There's just too much that isn't known, making any assignment of blame too much of a guess.
This was just released today and I wanted to share it with you all. This is police video of Zimmerman being brought into the station the night of the murder. You can clearly see that there is not one mark on him. The cops lied in their report just as he lied and they need to have consequences for that just like he does. This is ridiculous. Did they think no one would ever find out?
ReplyDeletehttp://news.yahoo.com/trayvon-martin-video-shows-no-blood-bruises-george-194108003--abc-news-topstories.html
It's been many day since you wrote this, and some new information has become available since then.
ReplyDelete1. CNN, after reporting that it sounded like Zimmerman said, "fucking coons," has had the audio processed to remove as much of the wind noise as possible, and now it sounds like Zimmerman said, "fucking cold." It was unseasonably cold that night.
2. ABC, after stating that the low-resolution video they released doesn't seem to show any injury, enhanced the video, and now you can see what appears to be a very large gash on the back of his head, and spots on his shirt that could be blood. Also, Zimmerman was treated at the scene by paramedics. If Zimmerman really wasn't injured, this would mean that ABC, the police, and the paramedics are all in on a quickly-concocted conspiracy.
You state, "Someone should have informed him before it came to this that being a black person in his neighborhood wasn't actually a crime." But note that Zimmerman doesn't mention race until he's asked about it. At least one of his calls to police in which he reported a black person acting suspiciously, he was going by a description given to him by someone who witnessed people leaving the scene of a crime. Another call Zimmerman made to police about suspicious activity involved 2 whites and 1 hispanic.
Also, you've made an error regarding Zimmerman's violent past. You state "Zimmerman's three prior violent arrests," and you note three items from court records. The first one for "resisting an officer w/violence," stems from a time he shoved an undercover cop who was harassing his buddy for underage drinking, and he didn't realize the guy was a cop. The next to items are not arrests, they are temporary restraining orders, one of which was one Zimmerman took out against his gf/wife at the time. Such restraining orders are given out upon request when there's a divorce/split. No evidence of actual violence is required.
The witness(es) who reported hearing "a little boy" whining must have been hearing someone other than Martin, who was a 6'3" man.
There are 2 or 3 witnesses who saw Zimmerman yelling for help while Martin was on top of him hitting him. Apparently that's when they went to get their phones to make their calls to 911, and did not witness the moment the shot was fired. One police officer wrote in his report that, while Zimmerman was being treated by the medics, Zimmerman said that he had called for help and no one came to help.
Zimmerman had no obligation, legal or moral, to follow the dispatcher's instructions. There really isn't any evidence that Zimmerman didn't stop following Martin. That's part of the issue here: we don't know who was where when the fight got started. Zimmerman has claimed he was walking back to his vehicle when Martin came up to him.
ReplyDeleteEither way, following someone down the street is not illegal. Nor is carrying a handgun for protection. Nor is following someone down the street while carrying a handgun for protection. I doubt Zimmerman had a good solid to be suspicious of Martin, but being wrongfully suspicious and following an innocent person down a street is not illegal, or immoral. It's just dumb.
"The last I checked, you murder someone, you make your claim of self-defense, you GO TO JAIL, you HAVE A TRIAL, and if the jury believes you THEN you walk. Am I somehow mistaken on this? "
Yes. The way it's supposed to work is: First the police have to find enough evidence to suspect you of a crime, then they arrest you, then you are charged, then you are tried. Step one has not happened in this case. The police have not found enough evidence so far to suspect that it is more likely Zimmerman was not acting in self defense. The law puts the burden of proof on the state, not Zimmerman. "Innocent until proven guilty" and whatnot.
"right before he was shot in cold blood"
Given that Martin had been on top of Zimmerman, hitting him in the face and hitting his head against the ground, and that Martin was shot in that struggle, it's clear Zimmerman was acting in the heat of the moment, not in "cold blood."
Zimmerman may not have had a very good reason for following Martin. Zimmerman may even be a racist (even there's no evidence of this). But, neither of those things mean Zimmerman is guilty of committing a crime against Martin. Martin may very well have been fighting because he feared for his safety, but that does not mean, if he struck first, that he had a good reason to.
If Zimmerman was following Martin too closely, or saying something aggressive to Martin, or making aggressive gestures, then he would most definitely be to blame for the conflict, and would have no claim of self-defense. If Martin overreacted to Zimmerman's presence, or was looking to act tough, then Zimmerman's claim of self-defense is valid. Unfortunately, evidence of what either of them did right up to the point the fight broke out is missing. We may never know who is really at fault here.
First and foremost, I listened to seven 911 calls Zimmerman made in the past. There were two that did not involve a black person. The first was when he called about a group of kids that played in the street in front of a house that wasn't his...he referred to them as a "mixed group", the second was when he called about his neighbor's garage door being open. So if you have links to calls he made mentioning two whites and one Hispanic, please feel free to post. I have yet to hear them. And he absolutely was suspected of domestic violence. In addition to that, he lost his job as a security guard for being too violent and his own associates described the fact that, and I quote, "When he snapped, he really snapped." He was violent. Shoving an undercover cop in a bar because HIS buddy is drinking underage? Yeah, that is inappropriate behavior. Getting fired from your job because you are a loose cannon? Also not ok. And then turning up admitting to murder on top of it? Gee, he might be a violent person. You think?
ReplyDeleteMartin was NOT a grown man...he was seventeen years old. The average male is still going through puberty at seventeen years old.Therefore, you have no idea how young or old his voice might have sounded.
I do not believe the word of the murderer on who the screams came from. I have also listened to the 911 calls, like the one here in the blog, and what made people call 911 was the sounds of either the screams or the shot depending on which call you are listening to. Witness testimony, including the words of Trayvon's girlfriend who was on the phone with him right up until the moment the fight started, has been ignored showing a very obvious biased toward the few statements in favor of Zimmerman over the many that are in favor of Trayvon.
There is absolutely evidence that he did not stop following Martin. There is the recent testimony of his girlfriend who was on the phone with him (Yeah, they FINALLY decided that getting a statement from her might be important) and she heard him following her boyfriend, there is the fact that you can still hear him walking as he is on the phone with the 911 dispatcher, the fact that he wanted the responding officer to call him when he got there so he could meet him because he had no idea how far he was going to have to follow him...and the fact that they were both away from Zimmerman's vehicle when he shot the boy down in cold blood. Please don't insult my intelligence. I think the police and Zimmerman are trying hard enough to do that with the public in general. He had NO REASON and NO RIGHT to follow him. By doing so he instigated that entire situation. But when you consider the fact that that was clearly his intention from the start (which is why he followed him with a loaded gun)I guess it all played out just as Zimmerman wanted. And it is continuing to play out like he wants. And you are so right...following an INNOCENT person with a loaded hand gun down the street at night isn't illegal...but guess what...SHOOTING THAT PERSON IS!
As soon as he confessed to killing Trayvon he should have been booked and thrown into jail until there was evidence supporting his bullshit self-defense story. Like I said, if the justice system typically worked like this, where a person confesses to murder and is simply let go because he said it was in self-defense, no one would be in prison for murder. A confession is evidence enough to hold him. Innocent until proven guilty is a right held by someone who is actually charged with something. Therefore I can't see where it currently applies to the man walking free after confessing to the murder of a seventeen year old boy whose only crime was walking down the street.
ReplyDeleteYou show me proof that Trayvon was ever on top of Zimmerman beating him...and I don't mean the word of the murderer or the word of the first responding officer who did not do his job. There is plenty of proof that Zimmerman is a fucking hot head who can't control himself and that he killed this boy because this was one time that "those assholes" were not going to run from him. The magically enhanced video done by someone on the staff of ABC shows what MIGHT be a mark on Zimmerman's head. It doesn't prove how it got there. And even if Trayvon had knocked the fuck out of that sorry piece of shit, it would have been him acting in self-defense. He was walking home, doing nothing wrong at all, and he was accosted by some loon with a gun. Trayvon wasn't out there looking for a fight but it is obvious in that 911 call and in Zimmerman's behavior in the past that he was. Bottom line? He belongs behind bars. Period. There is no reason for him to be anywhere else right now. Let a jury set his ass free if they feel that is the right thing to do. But he isn't any better than the rest of us. If the roles had been reversed do you think Trayvon would be walking the streets free right now? I highly doubt it.
By the way, I like how you mentioned how cold it was that night...Sort of explains that suspicious hoodie Trayvon was wearing that tipped Zimmerman off to what a thug nuisance the kid was, huh?
"So if you have links to calls he made mentioning two whites and one Hispanic, please feel free to post."
ReplyDeleteIt was in a call log. The Daily Beast listed them.
"I have yet to hear them. And he absolutely was suspected of domestic violence."
Yes, he and his then-fiance have accused each other of DV. In once instance, he called the police, reporting she came at him with a bat because he went to a concert without her. The cops are inclined to believe the party that calls first. Either way, charges were never pressed.
"In addition to that, he lost his job as a security guard for being too violent and his own associates described the fact that, and I quote, "When he snapped, he really snapped." "
The one supposed ex-coworker who made that claim may be telling the truth. Zimmerman may actually have an anger problem. Doesn't quite prove he flipped out on Martin, though.
"Shoving an undercover cop in a bar because HIS buddy is drinking underage? Yeah, that is inappropriate behavior."
Not at all. There's nothing wrong with coming to your friend's defense. It's not as if his friend was hurting someone, and the cop wasn't in uniform, so Zimmerman's reaction in this case is entirely reasonable. Zimmerman may have a violent personality, but the circumstances of this incident are not proof of it.
"And then turning up admitting to murder on top of it? "
Admitting to killing in self defense is not the same as "admitting to murder." Not only is it legal to kill someone to defend yourself from someone who poses a credible threat of doing you imminent harm, it's also very reasonable.
"Martin was NOT a grown man...he was seventeen years old."
He was biologically a man, 6'3", not a "little boy." I've known countless teenage boys, who sounded like older men, or like teenage boys. I've never met one whose voice sounded like a "little boy." Though, I'm sure there are probably a few out there. Has anyone put out a verified recording of Martin's voice? And, there's one witness, who gave a statement to police, that he saw Zimmerman in the act of yelling for help. The other witnesses who heard the yelling did not see who was doing the yelling. And, there's it's also being assumed that the person who yelled for help is the victim, and not the attacker trying to cover up their own aggression. It could be that Zimmerman started the fight, but was the one yelling for help when Martin got on top of him.
"Witness testimony, including the words of Trayvon's girlfriend who was on the phone with him right up until the moment the fight started,"
ReplyDeleteShe thinks it was right up to the moment the fight started. She thinks she heard pushing in that unrecorded phone call. She could be telling the truth as far as she knows it, and it still wouldn't quite exonerate Martin. She didn't see who pushed whom, or even which person approached the other.
"there is the fact that you can still hear him walking as he is on the phone with the 911 dispatcher"
Can you tell by the sound what direction he was walking in? The speed? The location of Martin at the time? For how long he followed him?
"He had NO REASON and NO RIGHT to follow him."
He actually does have the right to follow anyone he wants, unless he were on private property against the wishes of the owner. If you're in public, people have the right to follow you. What's important is if Zimmerman threatened Martin. If he was dogging Martin from, say 5 feet away, then it would be reasonable for Martin to perceive a threat and defend himself. But if Zimmerman were 50 feet away, then that's a different story.
"which is why he followed him with a loaded gun"
If he's like most people with a concealed carry permit, he carries a loaded gun pretty much everywhere... the grocery store, the gas station, while walking the dog, to a friend's house, to a restaurant, etc. The fact that he had a gun with him at that time doesn't suggest anything sinister. If he were not in the habit of carrying a gun everywhere, and only did so on this night, then that might indicate he was up to something.
"he should have been booked and thrown into jail until there was evidence supporting his bullshit self-defense story. "
In some backwards countries, that's more apt to happen. Here, usually a person won't get arrested until there's "probable cause" to suspect a person of a crime. Arresting someone and putting the burden on them to prove their innocence is not (yet) the norm here.
"where a person confesses to murder and is simply let go because he said it was in self-defense, no one would be in prison for murder. A confession is evidence"
Zimmerman's claim of self defense wasn't the only reason he wasn't arrested and charged. There was also the lack of evidence at the time to indicate he probably committed a crime.
"Innocent until proven guilty is a right held by someone who is actually charged with something."
It also means not arresting someone without probable cause... that is, not arresting someone in the first place and then trying to find a reason for the arrest afterward.
"You show me proof that Trayvon was ever on top of Zimmerman beating him"
Aside from the police, paramedics, witnesses, and police station video, you mean?
"He was walking home, doing nothing wrong at all, "
This is true.
"and he was accosted by some loon with a gun. "
This is yet to be proven.
"Let a jury set his ass free if they feel that is the right thing to do."
After the DA or grand jurty find there's enough evidence to charge him.
"But he isn't any better than the rest of us. If the roles had been reversed do you think Trayvon would be walking the streets free right now? "
No. Martin would have been busted for having a gun underage. If Zimmerman started the fight, maybe Martin would still be alive if it was legal for him to be armed.
"Sort of explains that suspicious hoodie Trayvon was wearing"
ReplyDeleteZimmerman doesn't mention the hoodie until the dispatcher asks what the person is wearing. Zimmerman said Martin looked suspicious because he looked like he was "up to no good" (whatever that means) and because he was walking around in the rain. But, because few people seem to be paying close attention to details of the case, they think Zimmerman was suspicious because of the hoodie, because that's what they've heard other people repeat. Naturally, people have a strong emotional reaction to the idea that some guy guns down a young man for no good reason and gets away with it. But the same thing happened in the Duke rape case. Zimmerman might be guilty. But setting aside the emotional reaction and looking just at the available facts... there isn't enough evidence, unfortunately. And just as unfortunately, people are grasping at what facts they can - like Martin's schools suspension - even though it's not relevant.
lmao I have NO doubt that Zimmerman was the one who called the police. lol Perhaps his fiance was wearing a hoodie when he came home and he felt threatened by it. One thing is for sure, he certainly knows the number to 911. I have never heard of the website you are talking about where that call log is located. Again, feel free to post the link to it. The fact that you act as if it is ok to attack someone because they are not wearing a police uniform scares me. What country do you live in? Seriously. I have never heard of an assault case where the charges were dropped because the defendant looked at the judge and said, "Yes, Your Honor, I beat the hell out of him. But he wasn't wearing any kind of uniform". The more I read your arguments on this, the more I understand why you are defending this guy. I am beginning to believe you might think like him. And again...that is scary.
ReplyDeleteI am not even bothering with your piece by piece argument on how there is not enough evidence. HE ADMITTED TO BEING A MURDERER! Do you know ANYTHING about America's legal system? I have a family member who killed her husband in actual self-defense. She admitted she murdered him, she explained why, she went to jail, she had a trial, and she was cleared because there was sufficient evidence to back up the fact that she was actually acting in self-defense. There is no doubt that he committed the crime. Do you comprehend that? He admitted to committing the crime. The doubt is his motive and that is what a jury is supposed to determine...whether he was justified or whether he is a cold blooded killer. This is not a situation where the cops suspect him...he did it. He confessed. There is no doubt. I can only hope and pray that whoever you are, you are not in any way involved with your local justice system.
The Daily Beast. http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/03/22/george-zimmerman-s-history-of-911-calls-a-complete-log.html Call #10.
DeleteZimmerman never admitted to any crime, let alone murder. I think you're confusing murder and homicide. Murder is a category of homicide, but not all homicide is murder. Homicide is legal some cases, such as self-defense. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder#Legal_analysis_of_murder
In order to arrest Zimmerman, the police need to show probable cause that the homicide was murder or manslaughter, and not legally justified. The police say they don't have that, and based on the information available in the media, that seems to be the case.
So far, there is:
No evidence that it was Zimmerman who got up close to Martin. If Martin cut between houses, then it would seem he doubled-back away from home and toward Zimmerman.
No evidence Zimmerman was chasing, pursuing, running toward, or doing more than trying to keep Martin in sight.
No evidence that Zimmerman said anything threatening to Martin.
No evidence that Zimmerman made any threatening gestures at Martin.
Nothing in Zimmerman's statements to the police contradict the evidence.
If the police get evidence of one of these, then they would have probable cause to arrest Zimmerman for at least 2nd degree manslaughter, under Florida Statute 782.11: Unnecessary killing to prevent an unlawful act... meaning they suspect Martin of starting the confrontation, but that Zimmerman went too far in using deadly force. But given that Martin was seen on top of Zimmerman and injured him, then it's harder to claim that Zimmerman went too far using deadly force.
"The fact that you act as if it is ok to attack someone because they are not wearing a police uniform scares me."
I'm not a pacifist. I think it's reasonable and acceptable to use violence to defend yourself and others, even against people in uniform. The police routinely beat and sometimes kill peaceful people. I know some people think the police should be allowed to hurt innocent people, or that they should always be given the benefit of the doubt, but I don't. I think they should be treated like everyone else.
""Yes, Your Honor, I beat the hell out of him. But he wasn't wearing any kind of uniform"."
Zimmerman shoved the plainclothes cop in order to defend his friend. He didn't beat the hell out of him. I think Zimmerman would have been justified in shoving the cop even if he were in uniform. Remember that Zimmerman's friend wasn't a threat to anyone, but the cop chose to threaten that friend anyway. And you seem to be holding a double standard here. You're supportive of the police for arresting Zimmerman under questionable circumstances, but you're suspicious of them when they're not arresting Zimmerman under questionable circumstances later.
"I am beginning to believe you might think like him."
1. I don't know the guy any better than you do.
2. Zimmerman was studying criminal justice to become a cop. I don't like cops. I don't like people who plan on becoming cops.
3. I've admitted the possibility he could be guilty. I'm only taking issue with the sensationalist manner in which the story is being reported, and the unsupported assumptions so many people are making. There are few things that upset me more than an innocent person going to jail because of emotional, hasty judgement. Putting an innocent person in jail only creates another victim.
Ok, for the final time...He admitted to pulling the trigger and shooting him which resulted in his death. That is a crime. Self-defense is a motive, a reason, a PLEA that one makes to explain why they feel that they are not guilty despite committing the crime. This is similar to when a person pleads not guilty by reason of insanity. It is a jury that then decides if this reason seems honest and if they feel it does, the person is let go. If you are so sure of your theory that, by the way, makes no sense....the next time someone is fighting you using no weapon after you started the fight by instigating a situation you knew could lead to just that and knowing you have a loaded gun on you, shoot that person. Tell me if the police book you and let you go because you looked at them and told them it was self-defense. Unless of course you are actually Zimmerman. At this point I have to wonder...strikingly similar views and all that. And it is just my luck that I would end up with a cold blooded murderer arguing his defense under what appears to be a very vague profile on blogger. Trust me, stranger things have actually happened to me....
ReplyDeleteNothing upsets me more than someone getting away with everything including murder because of who his daddy is, because of the pull his daddy has. I am fed up with rich spoiled pricks who never have to answer for what they do, who are never held accountable especially when they commit a wrong against someone who is not in the same position in life. If old George had pulled this shit on some guy at his daddy's country club I'll bet he would be in jail.
A seventeen year old BOY is dead. He will never graduate, he will never get married, he will never go to college, he will never have children. Anything he might have been was ended because George Zimmerman decided he was bored that night and he followed an innocent unarmed kid with a loaded gun and then he pulled the trigger. Trayvon did not start this. Trayvon did not follow George the distance from Zimmerman's vehicle to the murder scene with a loaded gun and without a reason. That was all Zimmerman. And because of his cold blooded actions, two parents buried their son without ever really being afforded the chance to see him live. What if that was your son? Would it be an issue to you then? That is the bottom line.
So from here on out, defend your position all you want. I'm not responding anymore. Have a beautiful day.
"He admitted to pulling the trigger and shooting him which resulted in his death. That is a crime."
DeleteNot true. It's only a crime under certain conditions. If there's no indication those conditions were likely present, there's no cause for arrest.
http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0700-0799/0782/0782ContentsIndex.html
"Trayvon did not start this. "
If Zimmerman said something threatening, or was making threatening gestures (such as following too closely), then you are absolutely correct. There's no evidence of it, though. Given the timing of the phone calls, the distance from the street to the house, and the fact that he was walking fast before starting to run, Martin should have been within spitting distance of home before Zimmerman even got out of the car. That he didn't leaves open the possbility he went after Zimmerman. From that distance, it's hard to make the case that Zimmerman was following too closely.
Zimmerman wasn't too close when Martin started running; he was still in the car. Martin may have ducked around a corner and then popped out at Zimmerman, maybe intentionally, maybe unintentionally. There's just too much that isn't known, making any assignment of blame too much of a guess.
Take care.